Mike Rose

After hearing and reading Scott's presentation, I am now interested enough to go pick up one of Mike Rose's books to read - sooner than later. Just the quotes that Scott included are enough to pull me in - especially the quotes about Remedial Writing Courses and concerns for the underprepared , truly basic basic writers

In regards to Linda Flower's concern with the cognitive process model, it is interesting and can be followed but with some meandering around. However, text in boxes, arrows, and changes of direction would not help my cognition. Perhaps I am not visual enough to appreciate this illustration, thus my preference is to read the miniature power point slides on the other side.

We are all different learners,

nancy

Nancy's Pedagogy: teaching in the ZPD/draft 2

Russian social constructivist Lev Vygotsky ( 1896-1934) stated that a child follows an adult's example and gradually develops the ability to do certain tasks without help or assistance. This concept is called the Zone of Proximal Development (ZPD)

Putting it in simpler terms, The Zone of Proximal Development is the difference between what a learner can do without help and what she can do with help.

This is the most important theory upon which I create my pedagogy. As a student teacher, I used the program: Accelerated Reader ( Renaissance Learning, 2007) which is based on ZPD theory. On the first day of class I had all my students make a small ball of paper ready to "make a basket."

First I put the trashcan too close with no possible challenge - and then far out into the hall where the challenge is too hard. The lesson is not wasted as one can hear the audible groans from students at both ends of the activity.

With a discussion they can see that a goal too high or too low will be boring or frustrating and keep one from learning very much I tell the students in the beginning that they will learn if they accept a challenge to work hard, and like wise if they are not pushed a little out of their comfort zone, they may not reach their potential.

Secondly, it is important for me to remember as an ESL instructor, I am more a tutor than a classroom teacher. Therefore, I must know my students as individuals, and learn early what are their strengths and weaknesses.

A teacher once admitted, referring to a student that we share, that I know the student better than she. The teacher was not threatened but rather appreciated the additional information about learning styles and hidden strengths that I can share with her.

There is a relationship of trust for a student with a tutor when a student feels he is getting more attention and relationship of a student in a class ( Harris)

This also means that I must " meet the students where they are" (Silva, Tony). In other words, no matter what the skill level when he comes to me. I will not agonize over what should have been, but instead start where he is and help him to make negotiate progress.

I monitor the progress of each of my students, with standardized on line tests, teacher made tests, observations, and conferences. For ELL students, we do look for competence in reading, writing, listening, and speaking.

Having said this, I have high expectations for my students and for myself. I support them with various kinds of scaffolding along the way, but I will not accept sloppy, illegible, papers that have never been revised and edited.

I push them to do what they can and just a little more. That includes self-discipline, self- reliance, performance in reading, writing and critical thinking.

First I will describe theories, methods and content for Middle school and then elementary school. As far as grading on the middle school level, I give grades, mostly for completion within the time frame given and with their best effort. To the degree that any of these are lacking, the completion grade will drop. Occasionally I will give quizzes or a test over information we have covered. This is one way to let both the students and I know what they know and what they did not understand.

Most of what we do is practice. In this sense I follow the process approach to writing. I ask students to journal, on current topics in the news, special days, topics we are studying and often their own choice - " what are you thinking about this morning."

We most often write in response to what we read, which is more nonfiction than fiction. I ask students to summarize, identify with, and critique the lives and opinions of famous people, such as Abraham Lincoln, Martin Luther King, Nelson, Mendola, Cesar Chavez, Jaime,Escalante, Yao Ming, Amelia, Earheart, Harriet Tubman, Harriet Beecher Stowe, Helen Keller, Rita Moreno, Jackie Joyneer - Kersee. From these selections, students can see themselves and those different than them in these pages.

I guess I am a social constructivist ( and an optimist)as I encourage students to read and write about the lives of famous people in history, as well as celebrities. I want them to be aware of prejudice and injustice in the world, which is often pointed at them, so they can wake- up and consider what they can do to fight for justice for all. As they discuss, and form their ideas they begin to learn to make convincing arguments eventually on paper.

One February I was visiting another teacher's class to present a brief lesson of the life of Martin Luther King Jr. as a young boy growing up. In giving background I including examples of how blacks were treated then and possibly still now. One tall lanky boy sat up and raised his hand announcing that, "Yea I am just learning about this prejudice thing." The other two teachers African American and Hispanic, were shocked that this 7-8th grade student was just learning about discrimination.

(From here to the end I am including elementary school children in my examples)

However, I am also pragmatic. I realize that students have life skills they must learn to get around in this world with success, and to enter the culture of power. I do not assume that students who come to me from other parts of the country have those basic skills that they should have. Not only do they not know how to summarize, they don't where to put periods or capitals; they don't know how to use a dictionary or a ruler.

For example, to at least half of my students, I teach study skills including organization, taking notes and how to ask questions in class. When I admonished my students to study for the upcoming science test, one girl looked down and admitted , " I really don't know how to study, can you teach me ?"

ELL and other struggling students need meaningful activities to learn language in context and cooperation and collaboration to support each other. For this reason I put students together with complementing strengths. For instance, I will put a good critical thinker together with a good reader or writer. Also a student may learn a new concept more easily from a peer than from a teacher. For example a student may learn from another how to write a good conclusion from a student who has had success with that already.

I have learned that collaborative activities need to have a product. It may be solving a problem, writing a story or taking turns writing down notes. Often the product could be a summary or a completed study guide. I have had one enthusiastic student who has already read a story give background information to others who haven't yet read it.

The elementary students also write about topics or in response to what they read. Recently first graders wrote about changes that show spring is coming. We went through the process picking out examples in the book and adding our own then picking a few examples and writing a topic sentence and three examples.

I want my students to fall in love with reading and writing. Therefore I am always looking for new ideas that make sense. For writing prompts I plan to use more pictures and also topics from the work of the of my students parents as did Morley and Frost( 1850). I learned another idea from a more recent writer who teachers students to write their own class news, step by step, using ideas of what is happening at home.

I am also working on topics that will inspire the argument or persuasive writing for elementary. however, our school district requires us to teach to the genres. therefore, we teach students to read and write for descriptive, expository, persuasive, and narrative. I agree with this as I was taught the various genres and feel that this also is a life skill, to bve able to write for a variety of purposes. And they are asking me, so I will give them time to journal, some days.

A note on elementary students and grades. I am not required to give grades here as I am in the middle school. Instead I have devised a series of points that students can earn for anything from a good paragraph, to good behavior. When they accrue 4-5 points depending on the age, they can choose something out of my "rewards" bucket - usually pencils and pens, small pencil

A final note: Just as ELL instructors can form a different relationship with students than perhaps their classroom teacher, it is also a goal of mine to have a strong relationship with the parents of my students as well.Again this is possible sometimes because I have more time than the classroom teacher to call home or even make home visits. Especially for those parents with limited English, ELL teachers can be a valuable and trusted resource. This helps to keep the doors open for communication on a positive note and will be valuable if and when problems come.

Cathy and Cynthia Selfe

Cynthis Selfe along with her frequent co-author have been encouraging and promoting a changing view of Technology and computers in composition studies. Cathy, very clearly in the beginning of her presentation, makes us aware of the diversity of Cynthia Selfe and her long list of areas of expertise.In her career Selfe has taught Hypertext theory, computers in writing , Grammar and Editing, Literature and Lore and .... Science Fiction. Seems to be a very versatile Gal - go girl. She apparently knows and writes about the Lore of the upper Peninsula of Michigan, Technical writing, Computers in pedagogy , Technical Communication and Visual Rhetoric!

Her first work was , The Benevolent Beast: Computer-Assisted Instruction for the teacher of Writing, 1983. In 1989 Selfe began writing with Hawisher as co-editors of Critical Perspectives on Computers and Composition. Besides her contribution to composition and computers, she also writes about Feminist theory in composition, literacy, educational reform, and writing comprehension. I am only guessing what is Writing comprehension. Could it be writing so others can easily understand your point, your argument? Would it be that the writer is literate enough - fluent and clear enough for the reader? Or is this about the reader ? The student of writing should be able to grasp what theories different authors prefer and how they apply those theories?

She and others would argue that visual information can be regarded as text, and that the power relationship between words and pictures is one that is not co-dependent, but rather it is inspirational. "Words inspire pictures just as pictures inspire words." This seems to me to be true and it is worthy of a reminder of it's truth. It has been true in fact before computers.

Summaries are always a good idea and Cathy's addition of Selfe's important ideas was helpful to this reader. The first point is that Selfe maintains that teachers must incorporate technology into the classrooms -and into their ( the teachers' )lives, because the students are using it. This one applies to me. Selfe would tell me that I must not let the gap between student and teacher to widen!

Secondly, we as teachers must not teach our students to be " indulgers "of technology ( by letting it be a babysitter, play games, or get carried away with "style alone." Instead we must teach them to be technology scholars.

Finally we must be aware of the power of technology to be a means of liberation or a means of oppression. In their article," The Rhetoric of Technology and the Electronic Writing Class," Selfe and Hawisher caution teachers that they must "assess ways in which the use of technology might shape, for better or for worse, their strategies for working with students."

It takes careful planning, they contend, to incorporate computers into our classes. We must not fall into the trap of continuing to make the teacher the lone power in the classroom, with teaching doing all the talking and students only listening, while not being encouraged to make contributions. They add also that drill and kill practice grammar software is also not a good use of computers in the classroom. ( I am not familiar with these kill and drill grammar exercises online) However, I would be interested to find out if these exercises could apply explicitly to give practice to L2 students in specific areas where they are weak or missing skills.

As with any new tools in the classroom, we must remain diligent to use technology in positive smart ways to help students continue their composition and discourse in a different ways.

Rhonda with Yancey

Yancey is a promoter of effective communications. Therefore she is interested in (print and electronic) portfolios, technology, and teaching students. She is an advocate for teachers and students and seeks to improve students' writing and critical thinking.

However, she also has the goal to help students develop into global citizens making cinnections between work and the world. She is enthusiastic about teachers using technology in the classroom - word processors, Blackboard, projectors, and internet, to help students become part of a global public writing.

Yancey is also interested in developing the Fifth canon - Delivery. Technology opens up new space for invention and multi ways of delivery as we witnessed with Rhonda's presentation. At one time I had started to learn about Hyper text and now I am inspired to continue my education in this canon of ( electronic )delivery.

Yancey is both student centered and teacher centered and it woulod seem she is encouraging both to use the technology that we have now and build on it. She also demonstrated her interest in teachers as she graciously engaged in an email conversation with Rhonda for our benefit.

Erika Lindemann with Rebecca

I always appreciate a warm up when about to receive new information of which I may or may not have background. For that reason I enjoyed Rebecca's "write-around," the thinking that came from the written discourse, and thus the social construct activity. Also the meaty hand-out was organized and easy to follow.

Erika Lindemann is a leader in Writing Program Administration. As such she is concerned about what will dominate the content of freshmen composition classes. She argues that it should not be literature as the time students would need to discuss the issues of the literature will take away from a focus on writing. In addition students would only earn to respond to literature and not other forms of writing.

However, she will not debate whether or not under-prepared students should be attempting to complete a degree program. Instead, Lindemann says the university should be asking these students, "what should we teach them and how?" I champion her statement that the university has accepted students and now it should support them academically with tutors or writing centers or both.

Rebecca quoted Lindemann to say that instead of having a literature centered freshmen class,,
"we ought instead to appreciate - the varieties and excellences of academic discourse." I may not disagree but it is still not clear to me what exactly she would have as content in the composition class. Yes, they will focus on planning, drafting, revising, using data etc., but about what will they write?

Through her concerns and questions that she uses to create assignments, Lindemann is clearly in tune with the needs of freshmen students, especially those who are not quite "s0-called college level writing."

On collaboration and peer tutoring with Thomas

Thomas presented to us the composition theorist Kenneth Bruffee, born in 1934, and so part of the rise in theories concerning collaborative learning. He also was one of the first, when traditional Rhetoric was coming back, to promote social constructionism.
Thomas explained that during the 70's and 80's there was growth in the number of nontraditional learners in college. These students were alienated by the LARGE classrooms with to many students. I can confirm this fact as I was in classes of 200 at a time for the first two years of college. I could have fallen over dead and the professor may not have even see me.

The support that was given to these students was similar to the classroom situation. Bruffe and others looked into this and and adapted peer tutoring into the writing center.
Thomas explained with clear transistions, that he was beginning a new topic about Bruffee.

Bruffee believed that students in college and beyond could pool their ideas in a collaborative classroom and in that way construct knowledge amongst them. The teacher may still be facilitator and must uphold this ongoing conversation. Equally important is peer tutoring.

Bruffee also states that though Cooperative learning seems similar to Collaborative work, it is not. Cooperative learning is for younger students and designed to lower competition, while Collaborative learning encourages discussion that brings disagreement and so enhances education. Bruffee sounds like a precursor of Graff who said "teach to the conflicts" to encourage learning. Finally Bruffee argues that "knowledge is collaboration with other people."
He does warn that through Peer tutoring and collaborative learning, students must be trained in how to uphold the ongoing conversation.

While Thomas' presentation had a large amount of print to read from the power point , his hand out had all the important information neatly summarized in four paragraphs.

I appreciated Nic's organized style as he broke down into three distinct fields - Richard Lanham's career. As Nic talked about Lanham's expert witness role when he evaluated the validity of claims -plagiarism and intellectual property, I wondered if Lanham was an attorney, as I had thought this work was only carried out by lawyers.

On digital Literacy, Lanham seems to have joined the ranks of our recent authors from Computers in the Composition Classroom ( or visa versa) when he said that we should rethink digital literacy and pay attention to the needs of the students in this 'new literacy.' Similarly the CCCC Position Statement included the acceptance of technology as an asset in composing composition, but includes their own list of recommended guidelines.

Lanham speaks of face to face , and one on one as being the best education. and Ohmann airs his prejudice towards technological determinism and the claims that technology will transform the workplace and the home not to mention the school, and how parents and students are worried about keeping up with technological literacy. Yet there are more concerns - that some schools are not responding well to the new information age, and perhaps the computers are not being used to improve learning.

So with all that technology can do for students and businesses ( making money) there are questions posed about the future. Back to Lanham: He says the issue is not that we don't have enough computers or information, in fact we have too much information in this age of information and there is a struggle to get people's attention. The economy or the rhetoric of attention! how do we get the attention of our readers or students. We must be "well seen , well heard and well read . "

It would seem, according to Lanham, that one answer is style ( of rhetoric). He maintains that that the style of our composition is as important as content. He might say it is more important!
If there is a change in the font, the style and size of the words can cause the reader will stop to think what does this mean! Perhaps with graphics, and animation and other media mixed in, of course the right balance, then surely the style will say something to the reader and make her pause and think about the meaning. "Brevity, clarity and sincerity! Language should be expressive!" says Lanham.

Oh, and I love the Paramedic Method of Revision. Thanks for putting on your handout!

Thanks Dr. S for introducing to us Dr. Burns

Dr. Burns for almost two hours gave us his academic past up until now - his success and his disappointments - when problem solving didn't work well. But that did not hold him back from reaching many goals.

His relaxed and humorous style of discourse was disarming just as he said of Mr. Booth, an important mentor in his life. I appreciated the time time he took to explain to us the nuts and bolts of what started long ago in Greece : The first subjects of study or the well rounded education at that time.

He wove bits if his autobiography through out as he also explained with examples what is Rhetoric: the what, when, why, and who.

As he gave us information that he wished he had had many years ago, he also defined some terms that confuse me less now: Topoi, heuristic, hermeneutics

Some things that I will take away from his inspiring talk are:

Find the common ground first before you find the point of disagreement.

Rhetoric has this effect on us- we try to persuade even as we are unsure, and we build the best truth we have.

Try to solve the problems even if we don't have all the answers.

And finally:
One should write if she is to be a teacher of writing!

Thank you Dr. Burns

Feminist research methodologies. Who has the right way?

From the '70's forward feminists and a few men have discoursed and sometimes argued about the correct methodologies to recover or revise the past in order to rediscover women who rightly should be recognized as rhetorics along side the men who have been noted as the rhetorics of history.

I am not clear yet what the different methods are to do research but I shall make a prediction. two familiar names are Patricia Bizzell and Andrea Lunsford among dozens of others who are leaders in this journey to discover the truth about female leaders in rhetoric of their time. In doping research says Bizzell is to do research on lives and theories and show some of their work, must show evidence and analysis to seek proof of objective Truth. Objective is the key word.

In doing this recovery work some feminist researchers have been admittedly subjective about their work as they are emotionally involved. Surprisingly Bizzell says in this case researchers recovering silent voices of women writers who have not been placed in history must approach differently ; that is they must have emotional involvement; they cannot be neutral in this case.

Still othes tried to play down the subjectivity and emotionin order to elevate and justify their argument. In some cases women were preachers , used language publicly and in other situations they were silenced, unrecognized along with the men orators of their time.

There are many unsolved debates about how this recovery should happen. For example should there be a separate female history or should women who were discovered be incorporated along with the men already know as rhetorics of the time. Some women were silenced by the use of penname and some women were silenced by playing the good (quiet) girl, high achieving but lacking an authoritative voice.

Karlyn Kohrs Campbell discovered and wrote about female rhetors from the 19th century who wrote about grievances and trying to justify their right to speak in public. With her discovery of audience awareness and persuasion Campbell could use these voices to instruct contemporary feminist theory.

As I spoke of, when discussing Lunsford "history of rhetoric class"including both genders, feminist researchers this time Bizzell and Herzbergs wrote an anthology including historic female speakers along side and in the same context as themales. from Aspasia to Christine de Pazan rather then creating one for women only.

No we already know that everything is an argument so the feminist rhetors had their version of Elbow and Bartholomae. If the men differ why should not the women have a pubic conflict? This famous debate was between Biesecker and Campbell from 1992-1993. Biesecker critiques feminist research that mimics the traditional mainstream ( male dominated). In doing so she was attacking Cambell a representative of feminists who Bieseckers accuse of reinforcing hierarchies and an causing the oppressed to be silenced. Campbell answered saying it was Biesecker approach that silenced women, by stating that all women have equal rhetorical ability.Bieker states that the problem is the canon needs to be modified to be more feminist.

Then Lunsford helped out the cause by creating a huge anthology of feminist writers that adhere to "forms, strategies and goals." They had different methologies but this diversity made it stronger.Lunsford also co- authored an article called "Border Crossings.: Intersection of Rhetoric and Feminism." Cheryl Glenn also wrote a single author book to study female rhetoric from the classical period. Her methodology was remapping rhetorical history by combining historiograpahy ( here ' s where I am lost) and recovery.

One of my questions is , If women were non citizens it would be difficult for their voice to be heard publicly but worse women were denied education. I suppose women could have been orators , preachers but there could not have been compositionists.

By 1999 the voices of African American and Native American voices were heard. the article tells of of one more debate between feminists. Xin Liu Gale argues that feminists have moved too far away from mainstream academics and cannot be trusted to be scholarly or truthful. The point she did not get was that postmodern historiography does not attempt to do away with notion of truth but attempts to think of truth differently.

The voice of reason : Bizzell says that gale is uncomfortable with the personal involvement of much feministic research and remember, Bizzell says this subjective approach is necessary. The writing of feminists grew after 2002-3 , and the rhetorical canon became open to debate.
Bizzell states that the canon should be "updated" and of course that was the beginning of another argument. Chicano feminists finally joined the discourse. By now in the 21st century the feminist rhetoric is considered mainsteam and is guided by paradigms of recovery and revision, flexible and individual for each researcher.

Who is closest to what I think is my pedagogy?

Although I very much admire and agree with Andrea Lunsford on her call for collaboration , and the importance of argument, I feel that I am closer to Graff and Bizzell in my pedagogy, in what we have learned about them so far. I would like to compare Bizzell with Graff soon, but for the sake of time and what I don't know, I will focus on Bizzell in this comment.

I teach L2 students, most of whom can speak English as well as peers but fall behind in reading and writing and as Bizzell points out - thinking. I am aware of the description of disenfranchised students who are multicultural and have a different community than many at school. I do not have trouble identifying what she describes, but I am always looking for better ways to teach them, to meet their unique needs and background so they can reach their potential and have access to the dominant culture - as needed. Therefore I am very interested in what Bizzell has to say as far as solutions!

Shaynee's handout was very helpful on one side and explained well what Bizzell believes and her theory of composition as well as pedagogy. She gave clear examples of where Bizzell fits in the composition theory dialogue and also the context of what she deems most important in teaching. Shaynee's points made under additive and holistic, parallels the description of Bizzell in Compbiblio thus making her methods and goals with student even more comprehensible.

However, I had not seen before the diagram on the other side of handout explaining Inner and outer directed model of language and thought development. It is slightly abstract and therefore I would need to read more and find more examples of these theories before I can fully process this information.

Bizzell believes in teaching grammar as well as values. She insists on giving her students models of good writing to help them put ideas into words, while valuing cultures and beliefs , which ultimately will be part of their writing. Teachers who recognize the importance of students communities and cultures will have students who can become more engaged in meaningful composition.

Besides writing or academic discourse, Bizzell has other goals for her students. She wants her students to develop "critical consciousness, a critical awareness of their own intellectual processes." This is important for students to become learners in the broad sense. She states that academic discourse is not "the best or only path "to this goal. She "examines the practice of teaching academic discourse as a construct" but also to see truth.

It is clear that she is as she sees herself, " a teacher-scholar." She seeks to promote social justice not only by writing but also by educating the disenfranchised.

Everyone needs a center for their pedagogy!

Scott Lee gave us a thorough list of what Gerald Graff's most important issues are in teaching composition. His two handouts, detailed with Graff's main issues, purposes in his writing, and where he fits in the continuum of a dozen other composition leaders, were very helpful for his classmates.

Graff is known for his chant,"teach ( students) to the conflicts." He insists that The Argument should be the center of of all pedagogy. As I consider this statement , I am thinking that I agree that argumentation or debate for all ages of students is an excellent method of building critical thinking skills, writing with a definite purpose, learning how to use academic language to make one's argument clear and succinct as Bartholomae would demand. Graff notes that these arguments must not be in a vacuum, but I would think arguing for authentic issues would not be difficult. As Lunsford and Ruszkiewicz book states,"Everything's an argument."

Certainly students are engaged when directed to participate in a debate. I have seen this to be very effective in Middle school and I have used it this even in elementary. In not arguing in a vacuum, I am guessing that debating the opinions of real people in the news or from history would be connecting with the real world and also content areas. Students could argue their hypothesis in science or the causes of a specific war, or the ethics of war. However, to get students started I wonder if especially the younger or the L2 students might start with arguments pertaining to school, one of their communities. Should students be allowed to bring cel phones to school? What about a dress code? Should the driving age be lowered? I agree with Bartholomae and Graff that students as part of learning academica should know well and be able to argue both sides. In fact I have done this at a wporkshop with my adult peers. We had to debate both of sides of is CSAP a good idea!

Graff differs from Bartholomae in his techniques of using templates to teach the academic language. Let's face it the sentence frames, or templates in his book will help adults ( me!) as much as our younger students. Sentence templates have been used all the way down to first grade to help struggling readers and writers make an accurate sentence. This is also very effective for L2 students at any age.

I like Graff's tendency to want students to learn to speaqk and write academic language and join the critical thinking through debate or argument, but I also praise his work toward scaffolding these skills for those who need it. As far as placing argument in the center of our pedagogy.. everyone needs a center for their pedagogy and I am feeling persuaded by Graff's arguments that perhaps argument be. In other words we should teach the conflicts; those that are authentic and, at least in the beginning for younger students, part of thier communities.

I would add that Lunsford agree's with Graff, but she would also add the element of collaboration.

Emily and Bartholomae

Emily's presentation on Bartholomae was organized in a way that made both the differences and the similarities more clear between Elbow and Bartholomae. Creatively she also took the wind out of several myths that she encountered about Bartholomae.

She points out that Bartholomae, like Elbow is also interested in teaching students to be better writers. Different from Elbow he sees himself as teacher in control. Students cannot teach themselves and if they did they would just reproduce "basic writers." Students must be taught what they came to higher education without. He will teach students to develop the second language of academia by dense reading and difficult critical thinking.


Elbow encourages students to write and to learn about and trust themselves. Bartholomae teaches students to learn to write and encourages skepticism. As Emily put it, Elbow writes first in the process and Bartholomae writes last after considering the critical questions and rhetoric. His students must explore through research. He wants his students' writing not to be subjective but scholarly - worthy of publication in the academic community.

Both have like minded peers. It is good that there are both kinds of teaching so that one could follow what is best for him or her. Lundsford like Bartholomae wants to see the whole argument worked out in her mind before she begins to write. While that works and is best for her, her long time writing partner Lisa Ede writes in pieces and revising as she goes, and after many drafts learning what she wants to say.

As someone else said, if I am beginning to develop that second language of higher academica, I need that dense reading and researching to explore critical questions. There is time later to switch over to Elbows' write-to-know oneself. Emily stated that both believe voice is important. But while Elbow believes that voice is a higher priority and must be discovered early as a writer, Bartholomae suggests that humans are socially constructed and so we must determine our place in the construct and then we will be able to find our voice with or against the dominant culture.

Thanks Emily for clarifying some of the mystery between these two important composition leaders.

"Peer Revison... for who?"

Unlike the Article, "Recopying for Revision" I feel strongly about Peer Revision. Like Rhonda I did not experience peer revision until I was an adult going to teacher's conferences and participating in those 'fun' activities. At the workshops it was not a true community but only a place to practice new ideas. It was only after Elbow and Donald Murray and Donald Graves and apparently Kenneth Brufee, and others came along proposing and teaching the process approach to writing.

Invalid or Invaluable? It depends. I have seen it work well in my classroom, but it true- it's not easy.

I was very interested in the research of Brammer and Rees, but not surprised with their results. The students mostly participated in peer review and feedback because the teacher required it and students valued the process in relation to how much the teachers expected them to do this and also to the extent that they were taught how to do this. Also, students who were taught and given more models were more confident in this strategy of peer review.

The students in this research are in a middle school. They don't come to school ( as Bizzell pointed out) with many ideas outside of their own community and culture. So it depends on what they are writing about . If they are allowed to write about things they know and care about, then they will be more engaged in writing and will value what they write. With more confidence, students will be more willing to learn about peer review as a way to develop their ideas and writing.

The article mentioned that students valued the process more in relation to how much training they had in peer review. Some teachers gave a list of questions to ask or look for. Definitely with middle school students,or younger, students will need very explicit instruction to build confidence.

Likewise, students should be steered away from any grammar or punctuation feedback before the content is first responded to. In the research they found that grammar feedback was often the majority what students gave and received. That can be helpful and needed IF it is after receiving feedback on the ideas and content and only if it is a student who is strong in grammar. Otherwise the students would be right who said it was a waste of time.

For peer review to be helpful, Teachers should give lots of scaffolding, and students strengths should be recognized. Some students who can't write a sentence well or or know where to put a comma may have great creative ideas. Students who can't spell may have a terrific oral vocabulary and be able to help with word choice.

Peer review in elementary can be helpful for both the giver and receiver but it would look differently than middle school. Like wise in graduate school peer revision should be easier but the principles are the same. Another point is that students can give feedback in other areas besides writing. There should be peer review( collaboration) across the contents. Often a student can help a peer work out a math problem in a different way, or one could give feedback in writing a lab report or figuring out a timeline for history.

I have always sought out feedback on my writing from my dad, my husband, my sister and my sons. Although I don't remember receiving organized peer review in classes, in the right situation, I would value it.

Recopying to Revise - Peter Krazke

Krazke speaks of his discovery, that recopying can be a superior method to revise, as more meta-cognitive and so more valuable learning tool than simply cutting and pasting on computers.
Backed up by Twain's explicit quote, his point seemed credible.
It does at first seem like a tedious exercise that may or may not help the revsing process. But though out the essay Kratze points out many who have experienced the smae "Aha." Donald Murray for one, gave his testimony that "rewriting a a draft is necessary to discover what one has to say on a subject."
Kratze makes the point that the ongoing struggle for students to write may be connected to the inability to think.and so scores from sat to Gre continue to drop. He states that the problem must be rooted in how we read and write. Highlighting lines in a text is not the same as writing notes in a margin. Writing in the margin would be either separating the important , or translating into the venacular, or summarizing - all strategies of meta-cognitive - thinking about learning.

If students are writing as robots, as Kratze suggests then there may be too much control- too much Bartholomae and not enough Elbow or Murray theories of writing.The question is raised, how to get them to join the conversation. But Kratze goes on to insist that students would take a better look at what they are writing and be forced to think about it if they recopy their papers.

My opinion with middle school students and possibly some high school students is , yes, they need to be taught or tricked into thinking but I have doubts that recopying is the answer. For one thing, students are very apt at simply rewriting their papers, as mine have done since we do not have immediate access to computers, without thinking. They frequently ignore their revision marks and comments and rewrite the same mistakes as they are writing as robots.

I believe the thinking must come in the first thoughts , the first lines or the first paragraph. If they are not involved in the conversation in the first draft, it seems unlikely that they would wake up in the second or third draft. I agree with the statement that students often don't see themselves as real writers and so they feel this is pointless because they don't know what they are saying in the first place.

Here, I can hear Andrea Lunsford saying that collaboration is the answer. With two people ( or more?) there will be guaranteed discourse which would lead to thinking and writing and more talking and thinking while writing. Two sets of eyes and ears would hear and see what is missing or what is unnecessary or a better word choice for revision.

Albertson on Albertson and Lundsford

Lundsford strikes me as an excellent writer as well as an activist. For her, writing is the way to make positive changes - by her and by others.

Her concept of forgotten Memory or the art of memory is still not completely clear in my mind but I tried to express this idea to the extent that I understand.
When I come to a word or idea that I don't completely understand, it helps to discuss it with another student or teacher.

Collaboration. This is why I gave the writing assignment. I wanted the audience to experience 'collaboration,' one of several concepts this author refers to. I wanted you all to try to come up with a definition or if not, questions about it. At least it might build some background to help grasp some of the ideas I would present. I also mentioned that this exercise may help you to come up with questions for the Q& A part.

I believe I showed with examples that Lunds ford is a Feminist, influenced by her experiences and also the feminist issues coming to light when she was going on to higher education and entering an arena that has not always been friendly to women. I showed also that this is also a problem for people of color or non- anglos by heritage.

There was collaboration of feminist writers who recoverd the the women's voices, the female writers that were silenced by hegemony.

Collaboration was referred to by Lunsford as a fruitful method of writing. She explained that when she wrote with her friend Lisa Ede. One would sit at the computer typing while the other was composing. Their method was to talk - write - revise- talk -write -talk and revise and so on. There was important discussion that went on which included immediate feedback and also with four eyes a better way to check for conventions and fluency of their sentences.

Perhaps I should have described more how Lundsford writes as an individual. The idea that she must not cannot write until she can see the whole argument in her head. When she cannot find a point to critique , something to question, she may make herself sit on the couch for hours waiting for the idea come. She says she writes fairly quickly once she has it in her head but she absolutely hates to revise. She does have to especially when the publisher tells her so. She has learned to trust the publisher and others who reread her writing.

I believe I showed that Lundsford is always thinking of and identifying potential or real problems and then brainstorming some answers. Her concern for students coming into the doctoral program and not staying or students who do not get in made her write about the importance of mentors, and she gave a good example.

The reason for replacing the GRE is the same as the argument against the SAT for college bound; "that the scores always favor white students." Culturally, there may be questions that relate more to an Anglo American's experience than to a person of color or other different heritage. Then there is the problem of engagement. Are students involved in their education in meningful ways . Could they be collaborating with each other or with teachers on writing projects. Why not have a shared dissertations? a good topic to research. Lunsford celebrates a wider interpretation of English studies which she calls breathtaking imaginative projects. perhaps some Professors are not asopen to change as lundsford.

Finally she expresses her fears but also her hopes in the Gold rush for copy rights and ownership of Intellectual Property. With collaboration of writing projects comes the question of ownership. Who is the author. On the one hand there is good old American Greed. On the other side there are ideas for working together, having shared ownership. I attempted to give some examples of both. Lundsford's writing expresses still an optimism that there will be more shifting of values.

As a writer, I struggle with having too much to say or not explaining fully. I think the solution continues to be that I must narrow the topic and identify what is important and what is not.

On Tony and Donald Murray:

I don't know if I enjoyed this presentation more because I already liked and was drawn to Murray's theories of writing, or because I loved the style in which Tony presented. Full of energy he wanted to be connected with his audience. He had the good idea of an activity in writing , first the wrong way and then the right Murray way.

Having the same idea of giving the audience a writing activity in order to help them experience a concept, I applauded and whole heartedly joined in.

Even though he took his 30 minutes he felt rushed and I felt rushed as I tried to absorb the last list of important information. I felt like I wanted to hear more about Murrays' teaching points and so I hope he will but some of his Power Point on is Blog for us to read.

I have been aware that New Hampshire and Boynton and Heinemann publish books from the process writing theory. They also publish books about second language readers and writers.

I wonder how New Hampshire, a whole state became an abundant source for a certain kind of writing?

nancy

On Ong and the inportance of spoken words

The problem with videos as part of a presentation for me is that while I am tuned in and watching it has my attention. But unless I take notes I often remember what I hear, more than what I see. Perhaps, there is an argument that the pencil and printing press did not lose the art of memory, but perhaps enhanced it. I remember what I read and what I write.

I actually do like all the videos that we have seen and prefer to have them because it gives me the essence of the speaker, his voice and gestures and tone. The medium is the message. Just watching someone move and speak helps us form a personality. ( ethos?)

Eric highlighted many ways that Ong gives importance to the oral word. From the spiritual, connecting with the what the bible says about "The word" being God, to the esthetic use of words in Poetry, to forming a group, an audience, and as a precursor to literacy.

The connection between oral language and composition is that discourse comes first. Lunsford says that one benefit of writing with a partner is that there is more talking before writing and so helps the writer to think and form ideas and arguments.

In fact all three presentations on February 10 emphasized the high importance of not just thinking but orality, discourse as a rehearsal before writing.

This is also crucial for second language writers.

Eric's printed and visual information with the diagram is helpful information to understand Ong and his theories.

Nancy

Comment and Rebuttal/ Peter Elbow's method


I have heard of Elbow and read some of his debate with Bartholomae, but it was very interesting and informative to actually see and hear him describing his memoir as a writer.

If Elbow is the first or one of several to initiate freewriting as a support to help students get started and to help them find their voice, then we must be grateful.

I do not pretend to totally understand this debate about sincerity and which kind is best, etc. The charge that Elbow makes much of having faith as a writer strikes similar to Plato and Aristotle saying that a rhetorist is more believable and convincing if he has good character. I don't know if faith and sincerity is kin to having a good character.

I supppose writers should be able to do "what ever works " as Elbow says, "functionalism. " By that, I mean if a writer makes a clear, and pursuasive argument by " the direct method: create a piece, finish it and critique it ( the dangerous direct process) , then it works. If the open-ended loop process with many drafts works to make a sound convincing essay, then go for it.

I do agree that Voice is important to the audience and the writer. I have not thought about the writer being uncomfortable in her own voice. But I do believe that finding one's voice is a worthy goal as it may add to sincerity or a lively ( life like?) quality.

Elbow says that the best way to be comfortable in one's own voice is to have a real/authentic audience which gives honest feedback. Apparently it is as hard to get honest feedback as it is to be honestly sincere. Although Lunsford may not agree with all of Elbows methods, she too is advocating honest feedback between graduate students as they collaborate on projects.

James L Kinneavy-

This composition theorist seems to have been a key influence bringing composition studies from the start of the 20th century up to the present. He is a traditionalist in that he believes there must be structure and guidelines as we saw with his triangle of four compositon genres borrowing from PLatos ruke of three : audience, occasion, and purpose

I really enjoyed being pulled through history with this presentation , showing who and what influenced kinneavy. I also appreciated Kinneavy's clarifying analogy to a window. This helped me start to understand what is expression, vs persuasive, vsreferetial, vs esthetically

he grew up being a member of a brother hood the Christian brothers. This disciplined life style at such a young age may be the discipline that he brought into "reinventing the rhetoric tradition" and making writing a scholarly pursuit.

Klayton told us that Kinneavy was upset ( perhaps toward the end of his life that composition studies was losing it's discipline and structure, that college courses were fuzzy and classes being taught by graduate students. I can't help thinking about Andrea Lunsford, three decades younger, who is all about having more and more graduate students have more opportunities to teach, rather than less, and in collaboration with faculty. Lunsford also would be the antithesis of clearly defined courses; instead, she recommends that faculty listen to graduate students and learn from their creative ways of producing composition with media.

Process and Post process and writing pedagogies

I enjoyed this discussion as I have been involved with the topic both as a Language arts and ELL teacher. I was interested in reading about MY history as it is a little less than 20 years ago that I received my LA teaching certificate.

I did not not know the vocabulary that goes with it but I was there.Somehow I got a hold of Nancy Atwell and then Donald Graves and Lucy Calkins?? I read Reading and Writing in the Middle and it made so much sense to me. The only pedagogy I knew if at that time was my own experience in High school and a little from my children's teachers. When my soons were in school I was too but I remember that writing was being discussed.

I tried to use as much as I could of Nancy Atwells information when I did student teaching and it served me well and I think my students. There and later in my first Reading teacher I asked students to journal each day often on themes of our novel. I definitelty think that exercise helped students to write good essays on the nuances of what they read. Later when I was restricted ( sort of ) to reading teacher I used Nancy's letter to the students explaining how we would have a conversation with them journaling about what they read and I would answer.

I am glad that Matsuda stated that, " There is no doubt that the process movement helped to call attention to aspects of writing that had been neglected in many writing classrooms."
I was not surprised that there were writers/teachers like Barrett Wendell who were trying to, " make composition a humane and intimate discipline. But I was surprised to read that, " the process movement hads been themost successful in thehistory of pedagogy reform in the teaching of writing."

I believe Mr Matsuda makes his point in the end that the process and post -process writing theories paralleled what was going on in second language writing. Just as the process movement developed theories against current -traditional rhetoric ; second Langauge writing began to move away from the audiolingual approach which did not include writing.

I am aware that the two pedagogies the rocess writing and the move to include composition within ELL instruction as valid , and turning to techniques as free association and emphasis of quantity over qualilty.

I am glad for the process writing pedagogy that has developed and yet there are concerns -both for ELLs and other composition students. Those that struggle with literacy either from lack of experiences and background as a child or because of growing up in a non english language, many students young and adult have gaps. They have huge gaps of vocabulary which affects reading and writing and they often have gaps in conventions, spelling and general phonics.

Thus the discourse over phonics for young children or whole language. My children learned to read and write at home before entereing K ( on a basic level) But i agree that there is aneed for phonics for those who need it and there is a place for whoe language. ELL students do much better when everything is whole. It is easier for them to understand the vocabulary in context, and frm there concepts across the contexct areas. Those struggling students do need explicit teaching in some areas but they also can benefit of a mix with the whole and process writing theories.

The culture of Bio technology

Again this was a very long article and seemed like others - repetitious. This author is not warning us that Bio technology is coming and soon we will have a chip embedded in our arm instead of carrying our little USB on a cord around our necks or on a key chain. He is warning us as writers and rhetorics that we need to make our stake and be writing as part of the whole process.

I did the math and I am glad I don' think I will be around by then. My one regret is that by the time they discover how to cure Alzheimers I will already be 85 and far into it if still alive.

We must pay attention and see that soon electronic technology and biotechnology will be entwined together. This will affect our bodies as well as our scientific discoveries.

Tis change will come soon and it will be driven as a commodity and it will impact our economy just as the computer technology has. Just as the we went from a record to a CD to a tiny device around your neck on a string that gives you unending music and other audio entertainment. It may just go away completely and be in our bodies like a chip.

The good is all the diseases tha cna be cured. People will be healthier and live longer... The down side is that there will be options like controlling your child's gender and intellect. Then it will be a society of the rich who can control many biological gene connected characteristics.

The author is not saying this is all good or all bad but just that we must be writing research , we must be part of the change as writers, giving our opinions. We have a responsibility to critique these changes as they come.

One concern that has been identified already is Intellectual property. Who will be the owners .. The scientists, the electro-technologists, the writers?

"As we learn, teach and write with new technologies we have a responsibility to analyze and mold the digital compositions of today and tomorrow."

The politics of MSWORD/nancy

This was a very long article to say just a few things:
Composition teachers should beware of the impact of "our word processor's grammar and style checker," on their students. ( Microsoft Grammar Checker)

It could make our students, Lazy, confused about their iwerd suggestio0ons or it just make their conventions wrong! This is similar to introducing calculators to math students, except that they are more accurate.

Teachers must teach students to ,"recognize computer interfaces are noninnocent.."

2 A second concern is that this real time grammar and style checker, as it pops up as the student is typing, will cause students to believe that grammar is more important than content.

We are all teaching that Content and voice, word choice are all important and save the

It is ubiquitous, nearly invisible, and increasing in power.

3Are the people , linguists and computer geeks wise enough to know what suggestions to make? Apparently not. I believe I have ignored everything except spell check.

I admit, I have come to lean on that and I dislike that this blog does not have it. In addition the computer I use at home only gives me a red line but no suggestion for a better way to spell words - BECAUSE- it bothers my husband so much he turned that tool off!

So apparently it is possible to muffle the MSGC

I don't believe that the MSGC was meant to take the place of a teacher any more than the calculator in math class. I do think that it was, for better or worse, a selling point on the computer word processor - like a GPS on a car. Are they more accurate than map quest which often steers people the wrong way? I don't know as we don't have one ... yet!

4. The MSGC takes away the choices a student might think about, as an author, if he were just putting the pencil to the paper instead of word processing.

Micro soft is apparently working to make more changes and update this tool , but for many it is too littel too late.

My only connection with this problem is that when I use alta vista translator. When I need to send a note to a Spanish speaking parent, I type in my paragraph in English and then click , it translates my paragraph into Spanish.. Well sort of. This includes similar problems. It may mistake a homonym with the wrong meaning. For example Manana means tomorrow and also morning. So if I wrote " I will see you tomorrow at 2:00 , it may say, " I will see you this morning." usually it is a bigger mistake that leaves the sentence not making sense.

However, I am on guard! I check the entire paragraph carefully and confidently make corrections when I am finished. After all I can write in Spanish fairly well. I use Alta vista because it is faster and easier. Does that mean I am lazy? I prefer to think that I am managing my time!

The suggestion at the end of the article does make sense. Teach our students what MSGC is and how inaccurate it can be. Discuss the shortcomings and encourage them to look at the options. Have them compare their answers to MSGC.

nancy

To get started on my Pedagogy Statement, I think I will take you up on the offer to answer questions first, and soon, I will revise it and organize it into themes.

First, I would identify myself as a tutor and as such I have to consider each of my students

individually. For ELL students it's about progress, but I feel this is the right attitude for all

students. You take students where they are and help them to make substantial progress. I

suppose I incline to go for mastery, when teaching skills. Whether it be writing a summary, or a

letter, or using quotation marks, I do want them to be within like 80 -85% proficient before I

move on. If I am with a large group and I have to move on, then I will try to give that one or two

students extra time for more practice. I measure mastery by number of mechanical errors in

their piece. However, I also pay attention if the student can both perform and feel confident

that he knows he knows and he realizes that he can do it.


I am not sure what your meaning is between mastery, or competency or transformational. I will

gues that I aim for a bit of all three. I have noted in my blogging that I would like my students

(especially the older ones) to wake up and be conscious of the world around them and the needs

of others. I am not talking about guiding them toward saving the world but just realize what

prejudice is, how insidious it can be in subtle ways. I want them to be exposed to if not text then

movies and discussion and then writing so they can realize and say," I have experienced

prejudice and perhaps racism and I don't want to add to that in this world and so being friendly

and kind to all is a noble and necessary way to live. ( So am I an idealist?) . That is one part.

Another part is what I consider life skills( albeit academic) I have taught children and adults

how to use the telephone book, use a ruler ( middle school) , how to use a dictionary and value

that. Study skills are a big thing with me. I believe kids who fail , fail for a great part because

they have never learned to find a way to be organized, to ask questions, to talk to the teachers

with concerns, to study. Too many students do not know how to study!! Also I want students to

fall in love with reading and writing. I want to prove to them that their are books they will enjoy

and that writing gets a bad rap. I do this by finding ways like the 1850 guys Morley and Frost.

I want to encourage students to write form their thoughts, feelings and experiences and

compare themselves to characters they read about. I want them to write poetry easily and

admit that it is not what they thought. I am always collecting new but simple ideas that will

make writing for natural and meaningful and so more enjoyable. Let's see, for example I am

going to use more pictures!

I want my students to grow in every way including academic skills. I want them to grow in

confidence, that they can do what they want and they can make goals and reach them. In writing

I want their writing to become more theirs, more sophisticated in style - dabbling with

techniques- maybe using foreshadowing and flashbacks in stories subtle inferences; in

nonfiction being able to make a sound argument in a provocative attention getting way. I want

them to grow and continue to grow their vocabulary and master the skill of giving great

examples that really work. I am impressed that the example has been valued since antiquity.


For ESL students and most,cooperative learning creates success. Students often learn better

from a peer than a teacher. The power may be more equal. I try to encourage and arrange

students who have different strengths and I am explicit in explaining the advantage of this.

One student may be strong in computer skills or organization or mechanics and another may be

good with ideas bit doesn't know how to do these other things.


I always want to be certain that my students hae some backgorund before getting into an

assignment or I must help them connect or build their backgorund knowledge. I feel strongly

that students learn best in their sphere of proximity. I have to be sure to push students to

reach their ability but I also need to be aware that I need to back up a bit because it's over their

heads conceptually or just in their level of skills mastered. I am also convinced that teachers

must be learning as they teach. teachers of reading should be reading and teachers of writers

must must be writing and using their personal writing as an example, in the sense that I have

good ideas but I need to revise and I enjoy writing. I write about whatever I ask them to write

about.

I have not covered all the questions I am sure, but I believe it is a good start for a first draft attempt.

Nancy and Packaging Theory ( or wrapping it up)

Boy am I glad I read Wendy Bishop first! I could understand most of what she was expressing. As each article has become more difficult to wrap my head around, i feel like the hiker hat starts off out of shape and out of breath, wondering when we will get to the top ( or the end). BUT if the hiker climbs long enough she begins to get in a rhythm and by the end she is feeling stronger and is almost ready to take on the next small mountain.

Here's another comparison. When I read ( tried to read) this last article I felt like the student of the losing side - the one trodding through the current-traditional paradigm. She was asked to read and write about abstract topics that she knew next to nothing about.

So the first of three distinct moments was the moment of practical criticism, and the next wave of anthologies - Adams, Kaplan, Lodge and others marks a subtle shift. I'm not sure what the third was.

Amongst this spate of anthologies seemed to have come a closure of theory; "Theory is no longer a contested domain, a model vying for prominence, but has arrived as a fully licensed paradigm." Now we have a canon to draw from. Is this to say that we now have a field of anthologies ripe for picking and there is plenty to put away for a cold winter's day?

the author has even better metaphors like the presidential hall- of Fame anthologies and the food group.

I knew I was lost when I read,"I see the history of critism and theory not only as a march of ideas, a progression of thought existing somewhere in the contemplative ether of intellect."

I thought, " We're not in Kansas anymore Toto!"

Then I read , "To diverge briefly, the second grouping of theory anthologies - the school/ approaches model- is the strongest precisely on this ground, offering theory as a system of alignments rather than statements of great Men." So Instead of great Men, we have Great ideas??

Finally I was confused about how feminism was being treated. "Feminism is treated as an equal grouping, akin to reader response or deconstruction." Then it says current theory anthologies maintain the institutional BRACKETING of feminism among the domain theory, acceptable as a literary subgroup - but not as a parallel configuration." ??? Is that a good thing?

I am sorry but I could not construct enough meaning for me to take much away from this article.

Nancy and Lucille M Schultz: Elaborating our History in the Mid-19th Century

At first I thought this article was truly about Diversity in composition Pedagogy.
Said Schultz, "the landscape of current-traditional paradigm appeared uniform even seamless" and then some,"features of the landscape that initially overshadowed ," and turned out to be "significant markers, ( representing, ) the diversity that characterized the teaching of writing even during a century dominated by Grammar, Rules, Style, and abstract topics."

Quickly I learned that this was not about Diversity but it was a race about compositon methods of teaching. I read on to find out who would win...

It seems that composition teaching on the college level was Still emphasizing Grammar first , followed by Rules , style and Only allowing abstract topics and NO personal writing. While this strong hold had stood it's ground for ... centuries? Quietly teachers , perhaps on the secondary or younger level ( not universities) were trying to find better ways to teach writing, perhaps to see them more engaged in writing and becoming more independent; having a less restricted control over what they wrote about, and actually writing about things they knew about- themselves and their experiences.

This didn't take off for quite awhile as the teachers of younger students did not mix much in those days. They did not have professional journals yet, or not too many and so the university professors did not learn about this new way to teach writing, for a long time.

The teachers of writing for younger students began to publish many books to help their students like "First Lessons " and "First Book of Composition." While John Walker's book called"Easy Rules fo Writing Themes and composing Exercises .." that contained Themes, Regukar Subjects, Easy Essays and Narrative. The theme section included six parts and 21 themes like "Nip sin in the bud." However, the teachers of younger students were giving students pictures and 1-2 prompts of how they could describe the picture, or the scene.

The then dominant thought at the university level was that "students learn to write by learning rules and young writers are not capable of inventing their own subject matter."
Two leaders who helped to interrupt these habits were Charles Morley and John Frost among others.
Morley I believe would give the student a model text to read and also some questions to answer, Then he would ask them to write an essay based on a skeleton of the story.Then the students are asked to write the story over in their own words.

I personally believe that though this will help the young student who may still need that support, that a writing teacher can give even more freedom to the student, For example the student could learn to respond with a personal connection , and so identify with a character or situation or she could write about another story that has some similarities of theme, etc. However I like the idea of giving students questions to answer to get them thinking about the story more in depth.

So eventually teachers like Morley and Frost began to publish and the wheels of writing pedagogy progress began to turn. The idea grew that students can write very good essays in their own voice about things that they knew. I am especially impressed with the idea of encouraging students to write about people and jobs that they knew of: carpenters and farmers , blacksmiths, and shoemakers, and the mason.

I think of all the students I have whose dads work in construction. Only once did I open the opportunity for a boy to write about his dad up on the roof , finishing the tiles. I remember he wrote with pride as he described how he had to throw up the right tool to his dad.
We had just studied Martin Luther King and his years at home with his Mom and Dad and the lessons he learned from them. The prompt was , "What have your parents taught you or what have you learned form them?" I still have a copy of his essay.

Starting tomorrow I will plan to include this kind of prompt for all my students.

Nancy and Richard Fulkerson/21st century

The topic was long and complex as was the article.

The topic might appeal more to a veteran professor; still as an outsider and in spite of my lack of understanding of many terms, I did have some thoughts as well as questions.

I am starting to form an idea of what might be Critical/Cultural studies. I am wondering if ethnic research ( from another article) and Cultural studies mean that people are writing about their own ethnicity and how they or others might be disenfranchised or marginalized in general or also in academia. Liberation would be the theme of this writing, or the unequal power in a classroom.
Dr. Souder admitted that this is true. Perhaps because I don't feel marginalized in this class, it is not an issue here. In my workplace yes, but I don't think I would choose that content to write about in a composition class.

I was surprised to hear the author admit that "no one in contemporary composition theory assumes any epistemology other than a vaguely interactionist constructivism. We rejected "truth" as derivable by deduction from unquestioned first principles."

However, toward the end of the article the author states that,"In rhetorical approach to composition, Epistemologically, adherents believe that values and decisions are reached through dialectic; Rhetorical teachers would not be comfortable with the claim that all truth ( reality) is is a social construct. They grant that evidentiary statements can be true or false. ( ie facts do exist)

I am not sure if I understand the above, but i am thinking that if I had to label myself in all these approaches , I would be a Rhetorical teacher of genre analysis. !?

I kind of understand the content envy on the part of lit-based course as opposed to the cultural studies ( that are not expected to actually teach writing). But what happened to writing across the curriculum. If all contents areas are responsible to be sure that their students write well within that subject, then they all would be teachers of writing in that they give opportunities to wite and their are certain expectations of correctness.

As far as the question, do we try to raise the consciousness of our students in addition or through writing , I think yes! "Helping them evolve as socially just citizens seems overwhelming ," but it's not so difficult to choose a short text or movie clips with a theme of justice and ask them to write in response, using that to help them form an opinion which they will use in a composition. In my class I used the movies Stand and Deliver and the Freedom Riders to encourage them to think outside their world, relate to the the students who also were learning , and to come up with their own opinions through writing. There are dismal statistics about how many teens know nothing about the holocaust.

On the other hand, I agree with the author, Durst, who says most CCS courses seem inappropriate, because, " Reading, analyzing , and discussing the texts upon which their course rests are unlikely to leave room for any actual teaching of writing.

Also, Durst said, teachers dedicated to exposing their own opinions of classism or homophobia could not accept student viewpoints that deny such views.

I experienced this in a theology class, post undergrad. I was taking a few classes out of interest. The professor asked us to write a composition explaining our understanding of one doctrine. It was openly controversial by different authors. I based an excellent paper on sound theologians knowing that my professor did not agree, and I was shocked that he dropped my grade one letter because I didn't accept his point of view.

I also noticed that in Chris Burnham wrote about Expressive pedagogy: the overiding goal is " to foster aesthetic, cognitive, and moral development" not to improve communication or encourage critical thinking. That approach would mean failure of ELL students. One of three standards for ELLs is to obtain English to be able to communicate in all forms.

Again I feel from the little I gather from this article that my approach to composition is Rhetorical knowledge, Critical Thinking, Processes, and Knowledge of Conventions.

Nancy More History lessons

All 1 posts on this page are selected. Select all 1 draft posts All 1 draft posts are selected. Clear selection Nancy (more) History lessons I did not agree or enjoy this article as much. First, the author Danald Stewart seemed angry. It is true that as the ancients said, when we want to persuade someone, it is good to be aware of the feelings of the audience. His arguments sounded like rhetoric in the negative connotation. Secondly, I am fatigued with the position that misguided composition teachers are ruining our children because we believe that grammar matters. ( I am trying to sound not angry - but logical. I hope to learn more about enthymemes and syllogisms as I continue in this class!) Third, from my own 15 years of teaching writing to K-adults, I know that elementary, middle school, high school, and adults who missed the basics along the way need punctuation and organization to successfully explain, persuade or entertain through composition. If young students don't learn to make their writing readable by putting in periods , capitals and commas, then when? If they come to college still not having this skill because some one thought it was not important enough, then it has to be taught a the university level. We know that this crisis is requiring more remedial classes at the freshman level. The argument that writers can use the computer for all their spelling and grammar needs is like telling the employees in fast food stores that they don't need to know how to calculate the math to figure out the bill, or even read the items in order to use the cash register(now with pictures) . Technology has taken care of that for them too. I do agree that there is a bit too much emphasis on the framing part ( 5 paragraph essays and other writing recipes) and often the grammar is addressed first instead of last in the writing process. But consider the shy student or the ELL that is culturally and linguistically challenged and will not write because she doesn't know how to start and is terrified. Vygosky taught us that students learn best in their zone of proximity. That means that we support learners on a certain level and encourage independence until they can move up the levels of freedom of expression where little guidance is needed. There are many formulas to help students of composition get started in the right direction. One mistake may be giving too much framing at a point where students no longer need it. Middle school students should have moved away from colored paper to help with organization and students in high school and college may not need the 5 paragraph essay structure. Happily we are growing younger and younger writers - K-1 who are able to express themselves freely and feel good about writing. With some direct instruction from the teachers, these young authors will go into the second grade automatically knowing when to capitalize to show the reader that a new sentence has begun and making that decision when to end a thought with a period! We have learned that the ancient orators had definite pauses, possibly marking the end of a thought. Eventually that pause, chosen by the orator, became a period in composition for the same reason. If orators were not taught explicitly, then certainly by example. I believe the sacred example is one of the best ways to teach writing. The following quotes from the book Because Writing Matters, by the National Writing Project and Carl Nagin, clarifies my point, in the section 'Integrating Content and Skills." ( pp 36-37) Donald Graves , proponent of writing -as- a process acknowledged that their research "prompted a rigid sequence for the writing process: a day of freewriting, another class on drafting,, followed by a workshop on editing, and then the final draft." ( Because Writing Matters 2006) Jim Burke, high school teacher in Burlingame, California and founder of CATEnet describes the problem,"States throughout the country are drafting legislation for curriculum that calls for renewed emphasis on the teaching of grammar ( or conventions). This stems from the frustration in the workplace and in college writing programs with students lack of grammatical correctness. (The English Teacher's Companion. 1999) Lisa Delpit, author of, Other People's Children, Cultural Conflict in the Classroom, focuses on the practice of "teaching down" to minority children. She says that focusing just on isolated skills can be boring and meaningless for low-scoring students. On the other hand when students are asked to"find their own voice" or write endless drafts, minority students may never learn the basics of standard English. Delpit criticizes those who view direct instruction as "repressive." "Students need technical skills to open doors, but they need to be able to think critically and creatively" (also.) "Let there be no doubt: a "skilled" minority person who is not capable of critical analysis, becomes the low-level functionary of the dominant society." "On the other hand, a critical thinker who lacks the "skills" demanded by the employers and institutions of higher learning, can aspire to financial and social status only within the disenfranchised underworld. 1 – 1 of 1

I want to respond to the two articles that are related to composition studies and the history from the turn of the 20th century.

The article Edwin Hopkins and the Costly Labor of Composition was a little confusing at first with Randall Popken as author but who took from Bruce Horner who it seems is experiencing what Edwin Hopkins experienced as a composition teacher at the university level. We did learn a great deal about our composition history as far as poor treatment or "the material social conditions professors had to put up with( tho we don't really learn about Mr. Horner?)

Horner says we value scholarship and publishing much more than teaching. In fact teaching is referred to as labor while publishing is called work!

The subject Edwin Hopkins, who we study, was a committed professor and writing teacher as well as a committed Christian. He suffered as his student load grew and grew and we teachers of writing know that this means more and more papers to grade and students to conference with.I enjoyed this article as I was able to connect or identify with him in several places in the article. I couldn't help thinking that ESL teachers in my district K-12 are working harder and spending less time with our students or less quality time. Out numbers like ELLs everywhere continue to go up. And additional teachers are not beng hired quickly enough. We are asked to do more and more record keeping and it takes away from our student contact time.

Though I am also a committed Christian I don't feel exactly as Hopkins did. I too feel a certain calling to be a teacher. But when I was looking for a job I looked not where I might be needed most but where I could be paid well.

I at times am struck with a desire to be more of an activist and explain to the top administrators that our students are getting the short end. We too as ELL teachers are marginalized. Because we are tutors, we are considered as Paraprofessionals instead of the licensed professionals that we are, and thus we are squeezed into the smallest work area , perhaps sharing space and often asked to move again to let someone else have our room. At one point last year I thought I had no room at all and was expected to tutor in the hallways practically. While I am a survivor I am not a fighter as was Mr. Hopkins. Just as teachers of writing , as tutors we need to individualize and teach every student differently according to their needs. This is one reason that I want to get a masters degree. I want to teach regular teachers to know better how to teach their ELL students, as we are often blocked access to them.

I was a little annoyed with Mr. Hopkins for letting his commitment to his students begin to ruin his health. He had a wife and I believe while our jobs are important - so is our family. Although I too have the same problem. Twice during my career my physical and emotional health was going down. My mentor said I cared too much! How do yo care less ? I have been married for 35 years now and though we have had our bumps., I am taking seriously how my stress affects my husband. and so I did not argue when I was asked to move to a second elementary school instead of an elementary and a middle school. I was working night and day trying to help those middle schoolers and most of my energy was going toward guiding them into the joy of composition. I was sad to leave them mid year, but the other teacher wanted to leave the elementary and be at the middle school and high school, and tho it was difficult, I realize now it was good for my physical and mental, emotional health.

I am grateful for the work that he and the NCTE have done to convince administrators that students need individual attention to their writing and therefore giving professors less student load. My son is a professor at a private school but he has a very very reasonable student load!! He has enough flexible time that he will be much of a house husband when their first child comes in May

Following are comments on the second historia compositon article - shorter but less interesting...

nancy re Wendy Bishop

I have just read Wendy Bishop's article,"Against the Odds in Composition and Rhetoric, apparently her conference-chair-address to an address to the 52nd CCCC. I actually had to look up the CCCC as I did not know what it stood for or who she was. Our little piece in Combiblio gave me a bit of background,and as I always tell my students: getting drawing on background to get started as a reader does help.

However, Wendy doesn't want to talk about reading but instead only about Rhetoric and Composition which she describes as "true love." I had to smile as I read the article. For one thing I was pleasantly surprised that while she was writing about academia, and the rigors of Rhetoric, I could actually understand, and even more, I could relate. So reading her article was enjoyable.

I loved her comparison between those of us who write and the description in Gerald's Manley Hopkins's poem "Pied Beauty.""Glory to God," he says, for the dappled, the plotted landscape, all things counter, strange, fickle and freckled."

She speaks of those who study writing as outsiders, perhaps mot valued for their scholarly approach to composition. But then she also imagines that if "our field" became dominant. She argues, I believe, that though it may be fatiguing, and scholars and teachers of composition may be against the odds compared to those who study liteature, she would still prefer composition. Other wise tho fatiqued if she were inn the llimelight, she may be bored.

Bishop prefers, "openness, a lack of plan, a chance to .. choose my own way," and believes that those who chose to study composition may be looking for a refuge from , "less hospitable spaces. Interesting thought!

In the last segment of the article Bishop seems to take off the writers' hat and puts on the Conference chair seat, I assume to stand up for Rhetoric and Composition against the Odds. Having been to many conferences NCTE, CCIRA, and TESOL, both participating and as a first time presenter, I had to smile at her accurate description of what goes on there - on the inside and out.

I agree with her delightful descriptions and metaphors. I too think that fatique and burnout can be fought by studying my classroom, keep going to conferences, celebrate good work, talking, listening and sharing.
I was happy to find myself enjoying our first scholarly composition.If I write less the next time , it may be that I didn't "get it." nancy

Why Comp Theory?

I believe if we study a subject, we will understand more and so become better at it. If we study composition theories, we may become better teachers, and hopefully better writers. In all of art there is a theoretical side which one can study and become proficient. There are many painters who studied and their art is exquisite. There are also artists like Grandma Moses who have fumbled onto a unique method and they too are able to paint beautifully. The same with music. There is music theory and a basic undiscovered singer is able to stretch and develop as a singer as she studies and adds theory to talent.
Then there is writing. Emily Dickinson I believe did not study poetry and low and behold she has produced much poetry that has lasted for gnerations. I believe she read a lot but perhaps did not study theories of poetry. The author of to Kill a Mockingbird, possibly only wrote one novel in her life, but what a classic beautiful work of literature. Authors who study theories may get better, may be able to write more, in short may have more success. Experience also is a teacher. However, I am fairly sure I am not an Emily Dickenson or a Grandma Moses, and therefore I am seeking to study Composition Theory, so that I may understand, and grow and be able to write academic articles as well as other forms of writing.

It's Wednesday and I can't believe I had to have a student tell ME that there is no school on Monday! Is it my new school? Is it the new baby coming - not mine but our son and daughter-in-law's?
How could I have run out of gas? I have never let that happen to me? Or, is it my new Graduate class that has promised to be rigorous? Maybe it's just winter allergies. I can't figure it out.